2017 Draft Prospects

Discussion in 'NFL Draft' started by titan_fan_4ever, May 1, 2016.

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  1. ImATitan

    ImATitan Pro Bowler

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    You'll fall in love with Cunningham vs Georgia.
     
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  2. GrayGhost1951

    GrayGhost1951 Starter

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    People see what they want to see. At times I believe I could do a far better job than some of these so called "experts". How many QB's have been taken in the last 10 or so years very high and were busts - including VY and Locker? Andre Ware, Leaf, Couch and on and on. Jrob finds a really good receiver in the 5th - but passes over DH not once, but twice, and gets what I think will be a bust in Dodd, and we waste almost a 1st round pick. I went back and watched him and wasn't impressed at all. Johnson may be worth the next pick, but that is still open. I have watched Peppers in a few games and really, he is just awful. Why he is rated #1 I have no idea. This is why I give up trying to evaluate. But if everyone was a genius, Brady doesn't go in the 6th, and Dak would have been #1 instead of Goff....so far. For every good pick there are probably 4 bad ones. I was watching Cunningham, and have been high on him all year until I watched his so called "hilite" reel. He was terrible half the time and looked like he was taking naps. But as someone said, when the ball is close to him he comes alive and makes great plays. How do you evaluate that? Foster has his weaknesses, but he is a hitter to be sure. Our D hasn't caused one fumble in 12 games (must be some kind of NFL record) so I would take him just for that. I don't agree with your assessments very much, but I think @Ensconatus is probably the smartest guy in this forum. Even though he accused me of being lazy and doing a cut and paste, I put it up there for feedback from other people. There are many ways to attack and play this game. I am off the mindset to get a devastating front line and then you can get DB's later in life that can do a decent job. You draft one first round and it's high risk. One hammy and they are out weeks. One tackle on a big back and could be a shoulder for weeks. I prefer to get some beef at CB, a really fast Safety that can help and have a very good front 7.
     
  3. Gut

    Gut Pro Bowler

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    I agree with you on the QB's...they get pushed up far too often! And it's no secret on this forum of my dismay that we drafted Locker in round 1. Most around here know I was so dismayed I threw my remote into something I shouldn't have!

    But one thing you need to understand is that draft prospects are just that...prospects. What team they go to, what system they go to, what talent surrounds them, what complimentary football can help them and how good the coaching staff is at using AND developing them goes a much longer way towards their success than whether or not they are an inch taller or .15 seconds faster in the 40.

    Fans look at Tom Brady and Aaron Rodgers as proof that someone got it right and everyone else got it wrong. But that's not true. The Pats thought Brady was a career backup and they drafted him for that purpose. They didn't think here's a great QB who we can steal in round 6 who could develop into a HOF QB. Sorry, they weren't that smart. You can read about it from their point of view if you care to.

    Same thing with Aaron Rodgers. When Rodgers came out, he wasn't anywhere close to the QB he is today. His armstrength was fairly weak and he didn't read defenses that well. Rodgers even said his success came from years of developing at McCarthy's QB camp for years! Helps he stayed in one system, developed in that system and had the traits to thrive in it after a lot of practice and training. If Rodgers had gone to a terrible team that played him from day 1, he wouldn't be this guy.

    Another example to me is Barry Sanders and Emmitt Smith. If Smith had gone to the Lions and Barry Sanders had gone to Dallas, Dallas is probably the most storied franchise in history, Sanders is probably argued as the Greatest NFL player of all time, and Smith is just another really good RB who got stuck playing on a bad team. people who only look at stats would say Smith has the most yards in NFL history so of course he's a better RB than Sanders. Those that watched them play, know that Sanders was the better RB and it's not close.

    Dak is playing out of his mind right now, but look at what he's surrounded by. A top notch WR, top notch TE, the best OL in the NFL bar none, and a top 3 RB. Does Goff have that surrounding him? Not even close except for Gurley...when he's healthy. It's too early to know which one will be better despite the Cowboys having a ridiculous season and Goff barely just getting to start. Should really take at least 3 years to even have a shot at a fair comparison.

    Peppers is rated very highly because he's a great athlete who CAN do things other players can't. When playing S and nickel he got a lot of pd's and tackles. Now that he's predominantly playing LB, he's mostly a contain player who attacks the LOS and attacks the backfield a lot...which is why he has so many TFL's. His risk is in his size and being unpolished at any particular position since they move him around so much. It's also in what scheme he goes to. Not only does he need coaching up, but he needs to go to a scheme that will put him in a position to succeed or alter it's scheme to accomadate him. He's much better at moving forward than moving backwards so if you use him like a Polamalu or Deone Buchanon, you might have the next Troy Polamalu without the hair. And size for him will be important because the closer you play to the box as a small guy, the injury risk is greater which is why injuries and size/speed, etc are important factors.
     
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  4. Clark

    Clark #ShoutboxAlley4Life

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    @GrayGhost1951 Not lazy. I was giving an honest tip on how to check your own evaluations.
     
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  5. GrayGhost1951

    GrayGhost1951 Starter

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    I watched Michigan versus OSU and saw nothing about Peppers that made me even raise an eyebrow. One on play, Barnett broke through and Peppers tried to shed a block and whiffed on him completely allowing a 41 yard run. Another time he tried to fill a hole and the back did a jump cut on him and he never laid a hand on him. I thought...this is #1 talent?
     
  6. Gut

    Gut Pro Bowler

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    This is what I mean by development. One of the problems players like Peppers (Adoree Jackson, Hooker, blah blah blah) have is that they aren't used to higher level athletes so they get lazy and sloppy with their technique. That's not the only time Peppers got faked out this year, but it also doesn't happen very often. That kind of sloppiness...which we've seen far too many times from our S's this year and previous ones is an important part of player development. Griffith had the same problem and never worked it out in the NFL so he whiffed far too often.

    OSU was not one of his better games. On the flip side, McMillian had an excellent game but Malik Hooker did not. In fact, he was worse than Peppers in giving up 2-3 big plays. Doesn't mean they are bad prospects, but they have some work to do. Adoree Jackson litterally fell down trying to turn and run with Ross. He's not used to seeing guys that are that quick and that fast. They need some adjustment time.

    Other players are more polished and only need to adapt to their new scheme. Once they start practicing on NFL rosters and going against much better athletes than they crushed in college, they learn that technique matters a lot.
     
  7. The Hammer

    The Hammer Ace Degenerate

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    I was just looking into Dede the other day, he could be good. Also agree with your FA wish list :)
     
  8. GrayGhost1951

    GrayGhost1951 Starter

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    When you consider what some of these guys make per game and watch them play like HS guys, it just makes me nuts. I think it was Blake that just stood there once with his head down and hoped the guy would run into him. How can they make it this far with technique like that? It's and old adage, but my HS coach always told me to watch their stomach and you will never miss a tackle. We also seem to have too many guys that just wait and don't go after people. I guess coaches are stuck with what they have, but hopefully Jrob gets us some real talent (and speed) in here soon so we can be contenders again.
     
  9. rekirts

    rekirts Starter

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    I don't really like walterfootball too much anymore but I like to see the weekly mock. This mock had us with Quincy Wilson and Peppers. I actually really like that draft. With a ILB Hightower or Collins in FA and a vet corner I think that would immediately give our defense the boost we need. We seem to like to rotate safeties already and I think you could line Peppers up at LB or S depending on matchups. Wilson just has the height/strength and probably speed you're looking for in a CB. If we draft a CB high up they simply can't be nicklebacks... I just don't see Jrob wanting to shell out 15 mill for a premier FA CB. Signing a great ILB for much cheaper and drafting the Cb seems more likely to me.

    I like peppers with the second 1 somewhere mid teens, kinda shied away from him when he was getting top 10 pick hype but if we pick near 16 I think its good value. Tremendous potential and hes got a player attitude.

    Also wouldn't mind another pass rusher with the first pick and a CB with the second. every team could always use another pass rusher. Morgan Orakpo won't be here forever.
     
    #329 rekirts, Dec 7, 2016
    Last edited: Dec 7, 2016
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  10. abc2330

    abc2330 Pro Bowler

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    Rodgers was always great. He set the record for consecutive completions against USC, the national champions that year, and could always make every throw in the book. Completely different than Peppers, who is probably more comparable to the big armed athletic QBs with tons of upside who might not ever develop into functional football players.
     
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