Gregg Williams turned down chance to return to Titans

Lol...

You're a funny guy. You spout off about this - which isn't true...then spout off about that...which isn't correct and then try to insult people who challenge you. I asked no question dripping of hypocrisy - but you knew that already. Yes, you told the world I was a Fisher lover though there is plenty of proof that I have criticized Fisher many times and have pointed out his flaws - which makes your claim incorrect at best. But you probably knew that already.

You make a lot of comments and when questioned thoughtfully about them, refuse to answer. That is your perogative...but of course, not conducive to a discussion. But you knew that already.

ROFLOL...yes, when you claim something about my posts - especially the 'two faced ones', I will ask you to show me what you're complaining about.

LOL...I didn't say Nickey was useless. That's what YOU said. I said I wouldn't re-sign him. There is a distinction even if you don't realize it. Furthermore, I need not play games nor curry favor with posters who insult me for no good reason - so your claims of child psychology are about as accurate as your Grandmother forcing more fumbles than Donnie Nickey. I do call things as I see them. Meanwhile, you say I'm NOT objective but you're the one saying you HATE Fisher. I guess objectivity isn't your strong suit...but I guess you knew that already.

Feel free to pipe in if you have something relevant to say....

Gut

 

Well...

Any drafted player who isn't a starter needs to be able to play special teams while they learn and develop with the idea being that down the road (1-3 years) they become a starter. Because you only have so many draft picks, you can't replace everyone year in and year out so some guys who are good special teams players you can leave there for now 'til you find a replacement. Sure he's cheaper than a fulltime starter and a good special teams player, but we know he's not a quality backup in terms of a S which hurts when one of your starting S's is having a bad year. Nickey doesn't play S well enough to consider benching a Chris Hope for instance so in that regard, he hurts the team.

My biggest points are that he's not getting better, only more expensive and that expense is better passed on to a better player who'll make a bigger contribution to the team. Chris Hope will need replacing...perhaps sooner than later and we have not developed any S who can play.

Your analogy of Mouton and McCourty are not really where I'm at. I've been moaning and groaning for years about the Titans lack of CB depth. The Titans didn't draft Mouton to specifically be a returner, they drafted him to play CB and if he can help out as a returner...great. While I like that they drafted CB's last season, I still felt like we should have brought in a veteran for training camp...not when Finny or Harper or Fuller got hurt. I didn't think Harper was our best choice and that a free agent could probably beat him before the season started (then the Titans could cut him and sign ANOTHER CB or...perhaps a vet return guy or a vet S like...I don't know...Darren Sharper. The ONLY downside to this concept is that we may not have as good special teams coverage units if the new guys can't play as well as Nickey. For better players overall, more cap room, more quality defensive depth and perhaps an actual returner, I'll risk it.

Gut

 

Blah blah blah

And yet, here you are DOING IT! What's the definition of a hypocrite?

Gut:ha:

 

Blah blah blah

This is one of the funniest things you've said. He says when you insult people that it isn't conducive to a good discussion and your response is...you think I'm dumb? LOL

That's funny, I thought you started the insults...oh wait, you said petty arguments...

Gut

 

That had nothing to do with it. Williams coached on 2 13-3 teams with fisher, one that went to a super bowl.

Fisher is no more conservative than any other head coach Williams worked under and no more conservative than Williams himself was as a head coach. Williams would have been able to run the offense the way he wanted.

 

lol

which would have been sweet seeing as he would have been DC


just busting on you I know you meant DC

 

I definitely don't assume that people are dumb. I generally try to wait until they show it themselves. That's not the point...

You said your only exaggeration was saying that your grandmother would have more forced fumbles? I'm pretty sure that you also said that he was worth less than a sack of potatoes, that a sack of potatoes is less than what you'd pay him to guard your turds, that Nickey having an "unnatural or funny" relationship with Fisher was the ONLY way he could still be on the team, and then some nonsense about Chris Henry, Tiger Woods, and a flashlight... I'd consider all of those exaggerations, with the possible exceptions of the last one.

Your whole post was exaggeration, and repeating over and over that Nickey had no stats. When both Gut and I brought up that special teams players often don't generate stats that show their value, and went on to argue other points, but you ignored all of that and slipped into your long rants about stupidity, bool sheet, and whatever else you want to call your last eight posts.

If you want to make an argument, take a step back and make it. Insults, exaggerations, and comments about how smart you are, how smart other people are, or about how smart other people think you are, all just look like attempts to distract from the points that other people have made.

I'm sure not looking for pity, I'm looking for reasonable discussion. There some on this thread, but it requires skipping a lot of posts.

 

Gut,

I understand those points, and would be fine if the team decided to cut him this season, or last season. However, I think so much of that comes down to individual evaluation that I personally don't have enough exposure to during training camp to judge. Maybe Mouton looked farther along in camp than he was. (By the way, I was referring to his play in the secondary, not his special teams play, in the last post) Maybe Mark Jones was badly misjudged. I just think that there are enough reasons to be able to believe that his presence on the team alone is enough to prove that the front office made a mistake. Yes, ideally you'd like all of your special teamers to be guys developing into starters. Sometimes, they take longer. Sometimes, they end up just not being good enough. Nickey was a safety valve, or an insurance policy, whichever you like better. Maybe he was more of a waste than an asset, but I think there are justifications for him having stuck around. There are always a few vets out there that end up coming back to the right team in midseason that make everyone else look dumb. Harper, McKenzie, Law, etc... I don't think we can beat ourselves up for missing opportunities, everyone misses a few.

We'll see if we keep him this year.

 

I think people are looking overthinking things here. Having Gregg Williams did not effect either teams road to the Super Bowl. The Saints have an offense and even ST lightyears beyond us, and they were actually healthy this year. I'd say that helps more than a new DC.

Titans 2008: 7th Total Defense, 9th stopping the pass, 6th stopping the run
Jaguars 2008 (w/ Williams): 17th Total Defense, 24th stopping the pass, 13th stopping the run
Saints 2008 (w/o Williams): 23rd Total Defense, 23rd stopping the pass, 17th stopping the run

Titans 2009: 28th Total Defense, 31st stopping the pass, 10th stopping the run
Saints 2009: 25th Total Defense, 26th stopping the pass, 21st stopping the run

Hell, even in the postseason, New Orleans didn't even rank in the Top 5 in the same categories! (9th Total Defense, 10th P.YPG, 6th R.YPG)

You're all making it seem like he wove a wand over the Saints and made them Super Bowl champs. Stop it. Their ranks got worse if we're giving him that kind of credit. Stop putting emphasis on one coach's arrival to one and pass on the other. We have better reasons for not making the playoffs. With luck, they'll be weeded out and we'll bring some of our guys back ha. If that happens, we'll start all over again just like every other team in the league next fall.

 

We needed Williams more than anyone seeing that we play Peyton twice a year. AND we actually have worthy defenders he can work with. What's he playing with in New Orleans, Daren Sharper at 34? C'mon we could have done something this year just like the Saints did.