What if we picked up Adalius Thomas and turned him into a pure DE

Discussion in 'Tennessee Titans and NFL Talk' started by eberry, Jan 1, 2007.

Thread Status:
Not open for further replies.
  1. Texas_Titan_1

    Texas_Titan_1 Camp Fodder

    Joined:
    May 3, 2006
    Messages:
    161
    Easily, he only ran 13 attempts. don't be like the rest of the media and praise the colts run d for be awesome durring the playoffs. larry johnson was averging 30+ attempts durring the year and only had 13 against the colts, they didn't stop him the play calling did. the cheifs unlike the other teams facing the colts just did not stick to the run. also of course he would have higher than average sacks, he plays on a defense that plays with the lead 90% of the time and in case you don't know what that meens, it meens that he can tee off on apposing quarterbacks all the time because they are always throwing, that won't be the case in tennassee. he is an average player asking for hall of fame $. but like i said if you like him so much buy a colts jersey and post on their board.

    Freeny Freeny Freeny!!!! I'm a Freeny homer listen to me.

    Get Freaking real. With all the holes on D you want us to go out and spend big bucks on this guy, come on. I can see spending it on Samuals or someone of that caliber, but freeny.

    OK im done now, I'm not arguing to argue, im just sick of all the Freeny this Freeny that talk, just putting things in perspective.
    #51
  2. Vince10

    Vince10 Camp Fodder

    Joined:
    Apr 30, 2006
    Messages:
    280
    Hard to run a lot when you get stuffed. Did you watch the game? The Chiefs were going 3 and out every series. It isn't like the running game was working and they decided not to use it. They ran the ball 1-2 times per series, and their typical series lasted all of 3 plays.
    #52
  3. Texas_Titan_1

    Texas_Titan_1 Camp Fodder

    Joined:
    May 3, 2006
    Messages:
    161

    and I suppose your saying that Freeny is the reason LJ was stuffed right, cause thats what were talking about. his ability to run stop.

    yes i watched, i also watched the colts stuff travis durring his first few series, but thats the difference i mentioned between the cheifs and other teams. fisch just kept running until trav finally broke a long one and started to wear down the d. thank god your not our coach, i can see it now. you call 6 running plays in the first quarter then decide well we only have 12 yards rushing so lets just pass the rest of the game. don't take it personally, but the argument is not if Freeny is the best or if the Colts run D is good or bad. Stay with me and try to remain focused, I know its hard for you, but the arguement is whether or not a pass rushing high$$$ DE if a good fit for our dead last run defense. I know youl say he can help we need a pass rusher blah blah blah, just answer the question honestly. CAN FREENY COME TO TENNASSEE AND TURN OUR D AROUND, OR COULD THE MONEY BE BETTER SPENT ELSWHERE? thats the $$$ question
    #53
  4. Gut

    Gut Starter

    Joined:
    Jan 7, 2003
    Messages:
    4,130
    Amusing...

    Um, the playoffs for the Colts has been 3 games of work. Here are their stats over 3 games and I skewed the numbers in YOUR favor by leaving out QB runs and FB runs.

    They gave up 178yds over three games on 52 carries. Is that enough carries for you to evaluate? For those counting at home, that works out to an excellent 3.4 yds per carry! And 52 carries is the equivalent of two full games.

    So again, please explain how Freeney - a terrible run defender in your eyes, wasn't a serious flaw in the run D. I mean, if you were the head coach of the opposing team, why would you run anywhere else? Fact is, the D was quite stout over the last 2 games and Freeney did his part. The things that changed since the season began to the playoffs was putting Rob Morris at OLB and altering the scheme. It also helps when the back 7 stop missing tackles. None of that you might notice, has to do with Freeney. Therefore, he's quite capable of playing RDE on a team that is excellent against the run...which means he's NOT a liability.

    Please provide some evidence to the contrary to support your point...

    Agreed, but he doesn't have higher than avg, he has SECOND BEST sacks and FF's over the last 5 years. There have been several other very successful teams over that span...like, say the Pats and yet none of their guys comes close. How do you explain that?

    And considering I've played AND coached football, I do know what it means to play from ahead...thatnks for asking.

    His game film AND his stats say he is an elite DE. Do you have any evidence that HE is an avg player? There are 64 starting DE's in this league. If he were avg his stats should be somewhere around avg. They aren't. Not even close. And to point out an obvious example, Jonathan Ogden is widely considered the 1st or 2nd best OT in the game and Freeney schooled him like Ogden's never been beat before (I think on a monday night game). If you watched their playoff game this year, Ogden basically held him nearly the entire game because he couldn't stop or even slow down his spin move.

    Interesting. You advocate getting Samuels, but if someone suggests another player I must be a fan of that team? Are you a Patriots fan? How come you don't say this to everyone about every player they suggest we get who isn't a Titan already? And frankly, we're suggesting players to make the TITANS better...so why would I or anyone else go buy a jersey from another team. Look at the top and you'll see what message board we're on.

    I like Freeney because he is one of the top pass rushers in the NFL, in his prime, and MIGHT be available. We also happen to have a GREAT need for a pass rushing RDE.

    Explain in any rationale how Freeney is not of HIGHER caliber than Samuel. Samuel has been a good player but this is his first EXCELLENT year. Is it a fluke? We won't know. Freeney AVERAGES about 11 sacks and 5+ forced fumbles a year over the last 5 years. Guess he's not a fluke!

    Plus, Freeney can make the entire secondary better by getting pressure on the QB (sacks or not). Samuel can't do the same thing...he can only cover his man or his short area of his zone.

    Yes...your own perspective that you don't like Freeney, claim he's an AVG player with no credible evidence to back that up (though I have tons of evidence to support him being a Pro Bowl player), and because you don't like him, anyone who wants him to help us and HURT the COLTS should go buy a Colts jersey?

    Interesting perspective!

    Gut
    #54
  5. Texas_Titan_1

    Texas_Titan_1 Camp Fodder

    Joined:
    May 3, 2006
    Messages:
    161
    Were to begin with this Freeny lovin freek. 1st off i congradulate you on having played and coached football, you have now joined the ranks of the majority of people on the forum, hooray for you (you should apply for a job in the nfl). like you said freeny has been the 2nd best player over last 5 years and again he played on the colts who lead in most of those games over the last 5 years (what a coincidenc).

    what else lets see oh yeh he dominated jonathon ogden (one of the best) but lets be fair he is getting old and right now is not the best. i doubt that freeny would have dominated ogden at any other point in his career.

    must give u credit though you were right about what changed since the begining of the season was that "was putting Rob Morris at OLB and altering the scheme" so your saying that he was the difference maker and not freeney since before that move the run d sucked. why not get him then and alternate our scheme.

    also with all your wonderful evidence, you should be proud that you have evidence of him being a pro bowl player, he is. I would have been worried if you didn't have it cause it does exhists.

    i did not see any stats showing that it was freeny and not the rest of the colt d that shut down there apponents.

    i am really tired of talking about freeny, i never said he sucks, i think he is good, not great. i just feel that there are other combinations of players that would help our team. Really man as much as you talk about him you would think he is Reggie White's twin. he's not.
    #55
  6. Gut

    Gut Starter

    Joined:
    Jan 7, 2003
    Messages:
    4,130
    Funny...

    And yet you continue to say he's AVG??? You imply that he gets great stats because the Colts have had good records.....well, how come the players on the other good teams don't have superior numbers to Freeney if he's ONLY avg? They don't. Taylor is the only BETTER DE. Therefore, Freeney must be excellent.

    Last time I checked, 26 yrs old is a prime athletic age! You're right, he's not the best...but he's close and MIGHT be available. The best DE's are certainly NOT available.

    Ya mean like 2 years ago when he had 2 sacks against him? Or in the playoff game drawing a couple of holding calls and forcing Balt to give Ogden some help?

    You left out one very important point...tackling. Indy's back 7 had several HORRIFFIC tackling games where they whiffed many times. That is the ONLY way you get 300 yard games rushing against you...not from one DE being steamrolled.

    Morris replaced one of the 'whiffers.' But that in itself itself doesn't do anything except eliminate one gaping hole. Getting Sanders back was another big improvement because he takes good pursuit angles and is a very good tackler...another problem eliminated. Changing the Scheme to play more gap control took them out of pure pass rush mode on every play which has taken away the easy draws and quick screens from hurting them as much.

    Freeney is not the main reason the run D has been so good in the playoffs just as he wasn't a big reason the run D was so bad in the regular season. He can only do his part and control a single gap. Is KVB a good run defender? He's on a terrible run D, right? So therefore he must not be any good (if I took your argument and applied it to the Titans). But the reality is KVB is a VERY good run defender even though we have personel and scheme problems ourselves.

    And yet you think he's an avg player. Good perspective.

    In case you hadn't noticed, it's a team sport. One player can only do his job. Even the great Ray Lewis becomes a more avg MLB when he doesn't have DT's taking up blockers in front of him.

    I didn't say you said he sucks, you said he was avg....and it's nice to see you admit you were wrong. He is good...very good.

    Rather than try to insult someone, this kind of discussion is better. So what combination of players would be better in your opinion?

    Gut
    #56
  7. eberry

    eberry Camp Fodder

    Joined:
    Apr 25, 2006
    Messages:
    323
    The Colts are not going to let Freeney go. They would cut other players & draft/bring in lower-tier FA's. I think I've heard Clayton, Mort, and Schefter say this very thing--if you really want to sign someone, you can find away to do it (especially if he's the only player on that side of the ball [besides Sanders] who matters)
    #57
  8. Soxcat

    Soxcat Starter

    Joined:
    Jun 20, 2002
    Messages:
    8,487
    I still think it isn't insane, ridiculous, or brainless to think that spending most of our CAP space on one player might not be a good idea. Also, "Freeney is not the main reason the run D has been so good in the playoffs just as he wasn't a big reason the run D was so bad in the regular season" could be argued with the fact Freeney didn't exactly have a great season. Only 5.5 sacks would not go over real well if we paid him a bundle of our free CAP space. In fact I believe if we paid big for him and turned in that performance for the year he would be slammed big time. We are talking about a guy who averaged almost 13 sacks a season and then turned in a 5.5 total in a contract year. Freeney also wouldn't have the benefit of playing in doors on turf, a faster and more advantageous surface for him. Freeney also didn't have chopped liver playing opposite him which allowed offenses to focus only on him each snap. Mathis had 9.5 sacks last year and almost twice as many tackles as Freeney. Guess which team gave up the third highest completion % in the NFL last year. The Colts, and only pathetic Houston and Detroit were worse. We can argue about the DEs not being responsible for the unbelievable 5.3 yards per carry they gave up on the ground but when in the scheme that allows you to basically go all out rushing the passer every down and you get 5.5 sacks and help your team be near the bottom in the league in pass defense I'm not impressed. Again I'm not saying Freeney is a bad player, he is a good player but he simply might not be as big of difference maker as we think. The Colts actually had one less sack as a team last year than the Titans. That is not all Freeney's fault but he certainly should get some of the blame considering the money he is going to command is going to be enormous.
    #58
  9. titansfan9

    titansfan9 Camp Fodder

    Joined:
    Apr 17, 2005
    Messages:
    1,101
    Texan Titan you talk as if Freeney sucks. The guy is a top 5 DE, and with him, 26 sacks becomes 41 sacks...
    #59
  10. oochymp

    oochymp Camp Fodder

    Joined:
    Aug 3, 2006
    Messages:
    1,422
    Last year they had to decide between Edge and Reggie Wayne, this year I think they'll have to choose between Freeney and Cato June, no way they'll be able to keep both, I'd guess they'd keep Freeney, but we'll see.
    #60
Thread Status:
Not open for further replies.