With Pac's Appearance At The Tropicana

Gunny,

Just to clarify then, in 2005 when the Titans selected Pacman 6th overall... ahead of Antrel Rolle (8th) and Carlos Rogers (9th), it was ONLY because of Pacman's ability as a CB.

In fact, his return game was only minimally mentioned when discussing which CB to take, because all the front office was concerned with was coverage skills.


IF this is your opinion, I disagree.

In my opinion, I think Pacman was taken ahead of the other two because of his KR/PR skills. The Titans used to be so weak in that area, that I think it played a part in who we selected.

Guess one of us would have to be in the war room to know for sure.

 

I don't think the KR/PR ability had that much to do with it, as Gunny said, it may have been an added bonus. I might say that our need at KR/PR might elevate Ginn over Jarrett, but a lot of people rank them like that anyway, they're pretty equal in abilities. I don't think it would elevate him over a top DB, say a Reggie Nelson or LaRon Landry. I'd say CB is the bigger hole, Wade did some returns this year, I'd say if anything it'd make us more likely to push to re-sign him.

Basically, I don't think it means we draft Ginn over Nelson if both are there, but it could mean we'd take Ginn over Jarrett if both are available, but I'd do that anyway, so that's why I don't think Pac's situation really affects much.

As far as returns, if you've got a good offense then you really just need somebody who'll catch the kicks, as long as we re-sign Wade we should have that regardless of what happens with Pac.

 

Thanks!

)

 

Well...

The problem is, return skills isn't everything and it isn't nothing. If Rolle and Pacman were rated the same, you'd chose Pacman for his return skills. However, if Rolle was rated higher, I think we would have taken him instead despite Pac's return skills.

So yes, Pac's return skills factor into the equation, but probably not very much.

Similarly, if we lost Pacman, Ginn's value doesn't increase 50% because he's an excellent returner. We'd first evaluate him as a WR and compare him at that position to the other players...let's say a Dwayne Bowe.

Bowe runs better routes, has better (but not great) hands, is huge, is an excellent blocker, and is willing to go across the middle. Ginn has awesome speed but doesn't have as good hands, doesn't run good routes, is not a good run blocker, and doesn't like going across the middle.

Ginn might have more upside, because if he developed his hands more, learned how to run good routes and run block (adding strength) and got used to going over the middle, Bowe would have better size but Ginn would have better speed. Ginn needs to develop a lot to be on par with Bowe let alone pass him so he has a lot more risk.

Add in his return skills and you have a potential project WR who could help your return game right away. Is that worth a mid-1st rnd pick? Is Devin Hester worth a mid-first rnd pick?

So return skills are valueable and important, but not anywhere close to the value of a WR or CB.

IMO anyway.

Gut

 

Please don't compare Ginn and Hester, Ginn is at least a decent/good WR, Hester is a liability in coverage, not something you want from a DB. The one thing that stuck out from last season with Devin Hester last season was one of his return TDs against the Rams, it was a very good return but what was lost in it was that the reason the Rams were kicking it off was that Hester had blown his coverage in the endzone. Ginn will be at least a #3 reciever for someone next season, possibly a #2, and he has potential to be somebody's number one reciever in a couple years.

 

Well...

But that's my point. Perhaps I should have used Dante Hall instead. If you have a draft prospect that is an awesome returner but you're not sure if he'll develop into a Steve Smith or a Dante Hall (or somewhere in between)...do you take him with a mid-first rnd pick?

When would you draft a player who right now is a '#3 with the potential to be somebody's number one reciever in a couple of years'???

Why wouldn't you sign Kevin Curtis instead?

Gut

 

I guess I could have been clearer, I think Ginn will more likely be someone's #2reciever next year but no less than a #3. And the things he's not as good at (route running, hands, run blocking) are all teachable things, get him with a good WR coach and he'll become a very good reciever. I definately think he'd be our #2 next year.

 

i gotta admit, I dont like Ginn, hes pure speed, nothing else